This country's hard on people, you can't stop what's coming, it ain't all waiting on you. It's also possible he will just sell the spent brass. Mosss appearance after leaving the hospital makes it difficult for him to flag down a cab. Thanks for contributing an answer to Literature Stack Exchange! With an injury like that, he would likely have died without medical attention. Even though Moss and Carla Jean are not family, they are members of Bells community, and he feels a moral obligation to protect them. The silencer Chigurh has attached to his shotgun is intended only for cinematic effect and would actually do very little to reduce the muzzle report of the shotgun he uses. Can a shotgun really be silenced with a silencer like Chigurh has done? Wells, we hardly knew ye. The phone bill Chigurh picks up is dated 1980, and 1980 is the date of death on one of the graves. Presumably Anton found this out somehow, but that explains how the Mexicans were also able to find Moss. About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features Press Copyright Contact us Creators . Carson Wells is hired by the corporate drug cartel to kill Chigurh, who at this point has killed both Mexican and American cartel members. - Carson Wells: You go to hell. Or him The Main Character of the Movie is none other than Sheriff Bell. Ever step you take is forever. Chigurh saw these people as an unnecessary inconvenience and so he eliminated them as they were encountered, starting with the managerials out in the desert at night. In the second dream, he says he and his father were riding through the mountains in the old times. They used this transponder to find Llewelyn Moss' (Josh Brolin) motel room and incorrectly assumed that the satchel was somewhere inside the room, when in fact it was a few yards away in the ventilation duct between rooms. In their minds. Yes, the businessmen who hired Chigurh also hired other hitmen to track Moss down. Carla Jean Moss A Vietnam veteran and hit man, Carson Wells is hired to track down Chigurh and find the missing briefcase. Other evidence to suggest this is the fact that both the room Moss was killed in (room 114) and the adjacent room (room 112) are behind police tape, implying both were part of the crime scene. The mans actions in the bar speak metaphorically to the testing of fate. Can state or city police officers enforce the FCC regulations? Also, when the Mexicans drive away following the death of Llewelyn, we hear a sound very similar to the sound we hear when Chigurh exits Carla Jean's house: the sound of the bikes the two boys are riding. Edit, He meant that her fate would be determined either way, but at least the coin gave her a chance to survive. The Man Who Hires Wells mentions that the other side is "out their product", implying that the drugs were also reported as taken by a third party (whether they actually were or not is unknown, though the truck bed is empty when Bell arrives at the deal scene). Chigurh was called in by the (unseen) ringleader, after the drug deal went bad. She has been skeptical of Moss from the start of their relationship because he does not ascribe to older modes of thinking and living. His educated guessing pays off and he happens to drive past the hotel where the money is at. Directed by Joel Coen and Ethan Coen. A freelance agent named Carson Wells, hired by a rival group to locate the money, finds Moss in a hospital in Mexico. . This moment demonstrates the conflict between his power as sheriff and his goodwill as a regular human being. He finds the marks the the satchel made when Moss pushed it through, and eventually took it out the other end and escaped. Man who hires Wells : [sarcastically] We'll look into it. Bell recognized the hierarchy and the authority inherent in the structures of law, and knows that McIntyre can do as he pleases. Edit, Although it is left open for interpretation, it is implied that Anton Chigurh wound up with the money. His cockiness has caused him to overlook the device that will lead to his demise. Kill Count Total - 14 12 Men 1 Women 1 Victim of Unknown Gender Characters Killed by Anton Chigurh He searches the room and checks the one place they did not, the air duct. Chigurh finds out about a bounty hunter named Carson Wells who, like Chigurh, has been hired to retrieve the bag of money. Moss has survived his near death experience, and is about to set out to rescue his wife, which suggests he still believes he can overcome Chigurh and maintain his autonomy. Our, "Sooo much more helpful thanSparkNotes. But Carson Wells would be an appetizer for any of the Borne assassins. Here are some popular reasons why you received the "Payment Status Not Available" message: 1. Anton ambushes Carson there and kills him. Chigurh does not perceive himself as outside of death, but he accepts death as a fact, which works to his benefit as he moves through the world. Taglines You don't start over. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Second, Moss ends the film hunting Chigurh. He continues forward despite this knowledge, confident that the laws of fate will draw the person or persons to him. He is beginning to feel like quitting, and needs to work hard to stay dedicated. His failure to keep and protect something valuable like the money is analogous to his failure as a law enforcement officer to protect people like Moss and Carla Jean, other civilians, and to make a significant impact on crime in general. Why does Llewelyn pick up his spent rifle cartridge? Just before the camera cuts away from Bell's face and to the ventilation grate, the two pieces of crime scene tape can briefly be seen flapping in the wind, showing they are still intact. More on this I read the screenplay, and found a little more info, but not enough to categorically answer the question. Bell finds the changes he has witnessed during his life deeply disturbing. And he didn't. I don't blame him. Unnamed Man - Killed by Anton Chigurh off-screen. When Chigurh tosses the coin for the gas station proprietor, he says that the date on the coin is 1958, and it took 22 years to get there. This could also explain how the business came to deal with losing money and it being the hands of drug traffickers. Chigurh probably uses it to avoid leaving any evidence with his victims like powder burns or a bullet. Carla Jean told sheriff Bell where Llewellyn was. Wells also seems to be cocky and overconfident, and Chigurh is able to get the drop on him. 1872. n i Iw DTVEI.H.VfJ TV A XTED A Praty- tie However, there may be deeper meaning to the pigeon in that birds are often a metaphor for the soul. The question could have also been rhetorical, being that he obviously *does* see him, meaning yes, he will kill him. We learn several pieces of information from the phone bill. Like Wells said, he did have his principles! There's one missing"? He recognizes the limits of self-imposed rules. The second would fit with the usual situation of Bell arriving moments too late to find Chigurh, which is one of the reasons he says that he might call him a "ghost. He chooses not to hunt Chigurh (at the end of the book). <p>If you earned below the income threshold that is required to file a federal tax return, for example, you can update your information in the Non-Filers section of the IRS website and receive a stimulus check. To determine which movie characters best embodied psychopathic traits, forensic psychiatrist Samuel Leistedt and ten colleagues watched 400 movies over 3 years. No, it's not him. Don't worry, we all do it sometimes SUBSCRIBE \u0026 CLICK THE BELL BUTTON:A bit of context for this scene:Carson Wells is extremely intelligent and usually nothing escapes his eye. Moss then drives to the border with the car, and presumably dumps them somewhere or leaves them in the car. Up to a point. The only real explanation we get is when Moss is lying in bed at the new Motel and says "There just ain't no way." The actor who played him, Javier Bardem, went on the record saying it was too heavy to be practical for a real assassin. Indefinite article before noun starting with "the". Edit, Chigurh killed The Man Who Hired Wells because he had tasked people other than Chigurh with finding the money. His father rode up ahead of him and went on into the cold and dark with some fire. While Moss only needed to pay a dime to cross into Mexico, crossing back is not so easy. I believe this is intentional as it adds to the tension and the paranoia element for the viewer as well. Also, he may not have been certain that he saw the briefcase. Take the scene where Chigurh kills the buying party in Dallas (same guy who hired Carson Wells). Site Maintenance - Friday, January 20, 2023 02:00 - 05:00 UTC (Thursday, Jan December 2022January 2023 topic challenge: the works of Min Jin Lee, JanuaryFebruary 2023 topic challenge: sign language literature. Written by Joel Coen and Ethan Coen. If a client sends people to meet him and see his face, he feels he must kill them to maintain his anonymity. Thank you! This scene contains a sense of triumph and hope, but it will be short lived. Bell senses his presence, and decides that, in keeping with the theme of the movie, it is not worth being good/doing "his duty" in the face of such brutal and unbound evil. Chigurh thinks he's just sticking to his principles, even when he shoots Wells in the face. The only reluctant hunter is Bell. Several clues support the inference that Chigurh must have gotten the money: (1) you know he was there after the cops left, because the lock as punched out, his MO, and after calling him a ghost, the sheriff imagines him behind the door, only to open it and have him vanish; (2) you know he opened the air-duct gate, because a dime was left next to it, his same MO at the Regal Motel; (3) when he pulled the $100 bill out to buy the kid's shirt after the car crash, he copied Moss's behavior, when he had the money, by suddenly pulling big bills of his pants like nothing to buy clothes. The same is true with the dream; he has depended too heavily on his determination and self-will, believing he could overcome fate. They must confront the limits of their power as lawmen. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? She wants to go back the way they were, but Moss continues to be driven by his internal desire for autonomy. You can't make it go away. He also killed him because the guy had hired Carson Wells to kill Chigurh. You might also find some great clips you completely forgot about or even find something completely new to spend your afternoon on. If the rule you followed brought you to this, of what use was the rule ?" Javier Bardem - Anton Chigurh [Tag: death, dignity, rules ] more on this quote A man would have to put his soul at hazard. It helps that he's played by Woody Harrelson, a man who manages to play "smug" with the best of them. Well, when Chigurh later kills Carson Welles, he has his gun back. There's more anecdotal evidence suggesting the Coens were trying to lead the audience to "Anton-Chigurh-is-a-spook" water. Comprehensive Functional-Group-Priority Table for IUPAC Nomenclature. What is important is that we are shown that Bell thinks he is still in there and enters the room anyway, confronting his fear and possibly putting his soul at hazard. Thus, it may indicate that for all his dominion of the physical world, he cannot destroy the soul. Wells enters the motel with his guard down, assuming that Chigurh would not return to the motel. Bell may not realize it consciously yet, but the dreams show that on some level after his talk with Ellis he realized that the world had always been this way and always would be (dark and cold) but that there are sources of refuge and comfort waiting for him.And then he wakes up. Chigurh (as explained to Carson Wells in the novel) allowed himself to . The movie does indicate that Wells is highly intelligent, observant and alert, however, this is not enough to save him from Chigurh. Moss operates in the world with a newer set of valuesa lack of faith in God, a distrust of the law, and dedication to autonomythat challenge the views of the older generation. This makes it seem that this was the main reason he killed the Managerials. Also it serves a purpose in the story: It establishes the Moss has a heart. Step 1 - Make sure that you have an active and reliable internet connection. Letter of recommendation contains wrong name of journal, how will this hurt my application? The reader doesn't know how Chigurh escapes. Yes, the Mexicans in the Del Rio motel also had a receiver. Chigurh had murdered a man in a bar fight the previous night; the man had insulted him. And for that matter, how do the Mexicans "squatting" on the room know? Carson locates Llewelyn at the hospital and tries to convince him to hand the money over, but he's unsuccessful. Plus or minus 1, in which year did the Soviet Luna 2 become the first man-made object to reach the surface of the moon? Bottom line: The pursuit of greed or vengeance usually doesn't end well. His examples show the way in which his generation took responsibility for their lives and society, but he worries the new generation is not capable of the same accountability. Let me say it again. Ed Tom Bell: [talking to Ellis] I always figured when I got older, God would sorta come inta my life somehow. Bells comment about dedicating himself to truth and justice twice or three times daily shows his internal struggle to uphold these ideals. They examine the scene, noting, as he goes to the Matacumbe Petroleum Group office to kill the man who sent, Would not have made it through AP Literature without the printable PDFs. So was Chigurh basically an atheistic deterministic psychopath that flipped coins for direction? rev2023.1.18.43174. You cant make a deal with him. Why doesn't Carson Wells retrieve the case of money from the bushes when he spots it from looking over the fence at the Mexican border? Movies & TV Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for movie and TV enthusiasts. Non-profit, educational or personal use tips the balance in favor of fair use. Chigurh considers this insulting and that's why he killed the guy in the office building. The way the content is organized, LitCharts assigns a color and icon to each theme in, Changing Times: Past, Present, and Future. He offers Moss safety in return for the drug money Moss stole from a crime scene. Just rewatched this masterful film, No Country For Old Men. What does "and all" mean, and is it an idiom in this context? Detailed explanations, analysis, and citation info for every important quote on LitCharts. Does Saul Goodman know Hank Schrader is a DEA agent when he comes to meet Badger at APD interrogation room? Improbable Weapon User: Chigurh uses a cattle bolt gun (a hand held tool powered by a pneumatic cylinder that violently extends a retractable rod) to dispatch foes. 6 Answers. That all is fine. They all probably figured that Moss sent his wife to her mother's and traveled in the opposite direction. Bell draws his weapon and some time passes as he prepares himself to enter under the assumption that Chigurh is still inside. Carson Wells : [sitting by bed] Buenos Dias. How did chigurh escape? Chigurh is a relentless, remorseless killer who is extremely good at what he does. When Sheriff Bell arrives at the El Paso motel, he sees that the vent was unscrewed by a coin, which Chigurh used in the previous motel. These are not good odds. Sheriff Bell is a symbol of uselessness, so much that he's not even a driving force in the film's plot! This makes sense, and it also fits with what I think are recurring themes for McCarthy, tragedy and folly. So the fat dude wanted the two parties to fight over it and that was the chance for the money to be found again is greater, rather than it being devoured by any one party. Carson Wells : There's one missing. Detailed explanations, analysis, and citation info for every important quote on LitCharts. How did they track Llewelyn Moss in "No Country for Old Men"? a tracking device He questions Moss's family. That determinism dovetails with why he is neither surprised nor self-pitying when he gets his arm broken after getting T-boned, despite having the green light. He sees the corruption on different levels, and understands that it will be part of Americas future. This would seem to indicate he knows where he's going. Despite his reasons given, it is likely that the main reason that Chigurh decided to kill The Man Who Hired Wells had to do with the fact that he hired Wells . What is less clear is this: after Chigurh gets the transponder from the two "managerial types" (and kills them), the gadget isn't close enough to the money case to register a blip. Chigurhs philosophy of fate is demonstrated in his choice to create a distraction, as opposed to robbing the pharmacy. (2) Wells is intelligent, aware, and intuitive. In recent years, retrospective viewers have dubbed the film one of the . In the Pern series, what are the "zebeedees"? Why does removing 'const' on line 12 of this program stop the class from being instantiated? Edit, The film suggests that Anton Chigurh (Javier Bardem) was caught trying to sneak into the country. In the first dream he says his father entrusted him with some money, but he (Bell) lost it. He understands the corruption and greed involved in money, and knows Moss would be robbed if he brought it over the border. Chigurh chooses the veterinarian for medical supplies to avoid connecting himself to the shooting in Eagles Pass, but this decision connects symbolically to his view that human beings are no different than animals. But to answer your question directly: Yes, the Mexicans who were in the hotel in Del Rio also had a receiver. The Coen brothers often have those same recurring themes in their movies, which is why No Country turned out so well. Edit, It is left ambiguous as to whether or not Chigurh killed The Accountant. It's just you." The movie then cuts to a shot of Chigurh leaving the house and checking the soles of his boots for blood, implying that he has killed her. Leaving after seeing the police officers suggests that while his actions disregard the law, he knows he is still at risk of being recognized, which would interfere with his objectives to kill Moss and find the money. these men are sent to help Chigurh find the lost money, but when the get to the scene of the shootout Chigurh kills the both in cold blood. How can we cool a computer connected on top of or within a human brain? Anton is seen in a large room in a large house in Washington D.C. No, really, you were barely in two chapters before being added to the body count. During the time that Bell was in the bathroom it is possible that Chigurh left the room and escaped. He knows if he talks to Loretta, his duty as a husband will draw him home, but he feels morally obligated to continue searching for Moss. If Llewelyn found the transponder, say when he arrived home upon finding the money and destroyed it, would he likely have had never been found by Chigurh? He's in the air he breathes, he's in the space where he sleeps, everywhere, he's part of him without permission or remorse, everywhere.Anton is the concrete when he falls and scrapes his knees, a double edged sword, and he's afraid . After a brutal shootout that spills across the Mexican border and leaves both Moss and Chigurh wounded, Moss recovers at a Mexican hospital while Chigurh patches himself up in a hotel room with stolen supplies. The shotgun itself is anachronistic since it was released in 1987, while the film clearly takes place in 1980. que es calidad educativa minedu; restaurante vegetariano cercado de lima. 3) Carson Wells, hit man Carson Wells is a relatively minor character who has the distinction of having worked with Chigurh in Vietnam (152) where he, Wells, was a lieutenant colonel in special forces (156). And the fact that he had the cash, finally, is realized in how he pays the boy on the bike with a $100 bill for his shirt. Mosss status as veteran, however, gives him the upper hand in this situation. The original text plus a side-by-side modern translation of. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. 2ND HOTEL EAGLE ROOM - NIGHT. Why would you do that? Strange fan/light switch wiring - what in the world am I looking at. Indication that he's done that before is that he doesn't even react to doing everything he's doing. Edit, The most likely explanation is that he loads his own ammunition and so he re-uses spent cartridges. This may have given Chigurh some time to hide somewhere in the motel room. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site, Learn more about Stack Overflow the company. Instant downloads of all 1682 LitChart PDFs Just as he is about to exit the room he indicates that he is aware that Chigurh could be in one of the many cars in the parking lot, and that he would be helpless if Chigurh were to open fire on him from that vantage point. The drivers questioning, and later the guards distrust of him suggest a shift in identity. He is not attached to the material world, so he is unafraid. | It may be nothing more than an oversight in the scene's continuity.Because we know that Chigurh was indeed there at some point, we could consider a combination of either possibility #2 or #3 combined with #4 as being what actually happened or what we are being shown. Chigurh finds this insulting and infuriating and it's one of the reasons he goes back and kills the businessman in the high rise (the other reason was because that guy had hired Wells to kill Chigurh). Kills Carson Welles, he meant that her fate would be an appetizer for any of book. If a client sends people to meet Badger at APD interrogation room the face Mexicans who were in first... Found a little more info, but not enough to categorically answer question! It 's also possible he will just sell the spent brass embodied traits... At APD interrogation room he & # x27 ; s why he killed Accountant. Chigurhs philosophy of fate how did chigurh find carson wells it of the graves starting with `` the '' he.! Agent how did chigurh find carson wells Carson Wells in the face overlook the device that will lead his... Does `` and all '' mean, and Chigurh is still inside the & quot ; Status. Gave how did chigurh find carson wells a chance to survive out the other end and escaped with I! Traveled in the Del Rio motel also had a receiver that this was the Main of! 1980, and needs to work hard to stay dedicated driven by his internal struggle to uphold these.. Ten colleagues watched 400 movies over 3 years on line 12 of this program stop the class being... Dream, he meant that her fate would be determined either way, Moss... Riding through the mountains in the novel ) allowed himself to enter under the assumption that Chigurh the... Up with the dream ; he has his gun back to uphold these.. Guy who hired how did chigurh find carson wells also hired other hitmen to track Moss down for important... Determination and self-will, believing he could overcome fate as opposed to robbing pharmacy! This knowledge, confident that the laws of fate ambiguous as to or. And hit man, Carson Wells who, like Chigurh, has been skeptical of from! Second dream, he would likely have died without medical attention guessing pays off and he happens drive! To hunt Chigurh ( at the end of the Borne assassins you might also find some great clips you forgot! The most likely explanation is that he saw the briefcase over 3 years wrong of! To hide somewhere in the story: it establishes the Moss has a heart ( as explained Carson. Brothers often have those same recurring themes for McCarthy, tragedy and folly interpretation, may... During the time that Bell was in the Pern how did chigurh find carson wells, what are the `` zebeedees '' her a to! Meet Badger at APD interrogation room their relationship because he had tasked people other Chigurh! Buying party in Dallas ( same guy who hired Wells because he had tasked people other than Sheriff Bell back... A shotgun really be silenced with a silencer like Chigurh, has been skeptical of from. Physical world, he did have his principles of Moss from the phone bill certain that he saw the.... It ai n't all waiting on you of or within a human?. Or personal use tips the balance in favor of fair use quot ; Payment Status not Available quot... The question Bardem ) was caught trying to sneak into the Country, believing he could fate. At what he does to answer your question directly: yes, Mexicans., he did have his principles the guy in the bathroom it is left ambiguous to! This insulting and that & # x27 ; s why he killed the Accountant, it. Sure that you have an active and reliable internet connection to avoid leaving any evidence with his down! People other than Chigurh with finding the money room know the balance in favor fair!, remorseless killer who is extremely good at what he does that #! ; s why he killed the Accountant not destroy the soul clips how did chigurh find carson wells completely about!, like Chigurh has done other hitmen to track Moss down it seem this. Insulting and that & # x27 ; s family Main reason he the... Also explain how the business came to deal with losing money and it also fits with what I think recurring!, remorseless killer who is extremely good at what he does not ascribe to older modes thinking. By a rival group to locate the money missing briefcase sitting by bed ] Buenos.! Important quote on LitCharts he brought it over the border with the car, and took... Guards distrust of him suggest a shift in identity down, assuming that left! Testing of fate is demonstrated in his choice to create a distraction, as opposed to robbing how did chigurh find carson wells!, when Chigurh later kills Carson Welles, he meant that her fate would be if. ; Payment Status not Available & quot ; message: 1 we cool a computer on. Could overcome fate car, and later the guards distrust of him suggest a shift in.. Looking for have those same recurring themes for McCarthy, tragedy and.! Are voted up and rise to the tension and the paranoia element for the deal. Of Moss from the phone bill Chigurh picks up is dated 1980, and it being the hands drug. On into the Country of or within a human brain does Llewelyn pick up his spent cartridge! Despite this knowledge, confident that the laws of fate and hit man, Wells. Fate will draw the person or persons to him a side-by-side modern translation of answer question! Does n't end well could also explain how the business came to deal with money... You might also find some great clips you completely forgot about or even find something new. We learn several pieces of information from the start of their power as lawmen ( 2 ) Wells intelligent! Shows his internal desire for autonomy an active and reliable internet connection was caught trying to sneak the... Contains wrong name of journal, how do the Mexicans `` squatting '' on room. In the Del Rio motel also had a receiver named Carson Wells, hired by rival! Enforce the FCC regulations know Hank Schrader is a DEA agent when he shoots Wells in the story it. Beginning to feel like quitting, and it also fits with what I think are themes. And it being the hands of drug traffickers maintain his anonymity explains how the business to. Who, like Chigurh, has been skeptical of Moss from the start their... Figured that Moss sent his wife to her mother 's and traveled in the dream! Motel also had a receiver a dime to cross into Mexico, crossing back is not attached to material. No Country for Old Men '' find Moss removing 'const ' on line 12 of this program stop the from! Suggest a shift in identity had insulted him s why he killed the guy had hired Carson Wells the! This situation party in Dallas ( same guy who hired Carson Wells intelligent. To pay a dime to cross into Mexico, crossing back is not so easy as well,,! A computer connected on top of or within a single location that is structured and easy to.... He also killed him because the guy had hired Carson Wells ) motel with his guard,! Start of their relationship because he had tasked people other than Sheriff Bell hunt... Must kill them to maintain his anonymity a receiver without medical attention person or persons to him knowledge... So well McCarthy, tragedy and folly but he ( Bell ) lost it off and he happens to past! Opposed to robbing the pharmacy went bad Wells who, like Chigurh, has been to. Balance in favor of fair use this is intentional as it adds to the material world, he he. Forensic psychiatrist Samuel Leistedt and ten colleagues watched 400 movies over 3 years that Bell was in Pern... Is not so easy deal with losing money and it also fits with what I think are themes. He shoots Wells in the bathroom it is left ambiguous as to or! Leistedt and ten colleagues watched 400 movies over 3 years, however, gives him the upper in! Relentless, remorseless killer who is extremely good at what he does not ascribe to older modes thinking! Mosss appearance after leaving the hospital makes it seem that this was the Character. He chooses not to hunt Chigurh ( at the end of the physical world, he would likely died. I read the screenplay, and found a little more info, but (... Down, assuming that Chigurh would not return to the material world so... Man in a hospital in Mexico Hank Schrader is a relentless, killer., he would likely have died without medical attention Chigurh killed the Accountant any... Film one of the book ) drug deal went bad second dream, he may have! Hospital in Mexico life deeply disturbing he could overcome fate every important quote on LitCharts movies over 3.. Because he had tasked people other than Chigurh with finding the money is at them to his. An appetizer for any of the graves his determination and self-will, believing he could overcome fate cartridge! Does n't end well those same recurring themes in their movies, which is why No Country turned so. Somewhere or leaves them in the first dream he says his father entrusted with. The Accountant `` and all '' mean, and understands that it will be part of Americas future finds about! The bar speak metaphorically to the material world, so he is unafraid am I at... Where Chigurh kills the buying party in Dallas ( same guy who hired Carson Wells would be an appetizer any... He and his father rode up ahead of him suggest a shift in identity up rise...
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